Autopsy Scheduled Today on Driver Fatally Shot By AmCan Police

Ernie Stoddard March 19, 2013 at 05:40 pm

You are very right Doug. But in the end, after all the cops investigate the shooter (cop) they will find it to be JUSTIFIED!! I don't believe I have ever seen one reported in Napa County that was ever, not justified.

Loui Loui March 19, 2013 at 05:54 pm

How are you stopping someone who's driving, with a taser? Do you want the officers to just lay back and wait til this individual causes a accident, from driving recklessly on the road and innocent people die?
What would you have preferred to have happened? How would you justify this situation? My answer, I would have liked this man to just have pulled over and let the officers see what was going on.

Ernie Stoddard March 19, 2013 at 06:05 pm

So let me see, you can't use a taser because he was driving. But you can use a gun to kill the driver (and the car could not cause any damage)? Would not crash into a house and kill someone? The point is the truck was stopped, and at this point a taser could have been used, or a police dog, something besides SHOOT TO KILL.

Loui Loui March 19, 2013 at 06:16 pm

Ernie, He just shouldn't had ran from the police.

Ernie Stoddard March 19, 2013 at 06:26 pm

Louise I agree with you he should not have run. That still does not give the officer the right to shoot an kill someone. You see police chases all the time on the news, but no one ends up being killed.

Loui Loui March 19, 2013 at 06:40 pm

Yes - End of Summer last year, Napa resident. The guy was in his late teens or early 20s. He robbed a store in Vallejo, with a stolen vehicle. He ran from the cops, crashed his truck, continued to run on foot though a neighborhood. He was shot and killed by the cops.
Maybe the cop didn't intend on killing him. Did you think the cop was in anyway scared as well? He wanted to go home to his family at the end of the day, too.

Joy K March 19, 2013 at 06:50 pm

How do you know the truck was stopped when he was shot? I didn't see this in any statements issued by Napa County Sheriff. To use a taser there has to be a certain amount of distance between the user and the person it's being used on - not that we have facts but I will personally assume that apparently this was not an option. If the driver was still in the vehicle - how would a police dog have made any difference in this situation? Honestly, the vehicle itself could have been the weapon and believe it or not a taser doesn't do anything to a vehicle nor does a police dog (no matter how bad a** they appear). What I do want to know is what would you be saying if your child or family had been hit by this vehicle while it was not stopping or if your loved one was one of the officers that was in the situation and let's say they stood there and did nothing while either they were killed or some other innocent person - we do not know what the threat was but since you want to keep "what if'ing" then let's at least look at both sides of the story of "what if's". I've said it before and I'll say it again - NONE of us were there and this Monday morning quarterbacking is solving nothing, actually it's just ridiculous.

Joy K March 19, 2013 at 06:54 pm

BTW - I'm so super glad to know that you're obviously a cop and risk your life everyday out there to keep my family safe. (extremely sarcastic tone) This is the only reason you are such an expert on the matter of what rights police officers should and shouldn't have.

Ernie Stoddard March 19, 2013 at 07:16 pm

Every cop that risk's his life everyday had a choice weather to join the police or not. He chose that profession, he knew what the risks were.
Every cop is going to be against this. We tried calling for a Police Review Board in Dec. of 97 when my son was shot (in the head) and killed. Cops reviewing cops (Napa PD & SO, St.Helena and CHP) there finding was it was justifiable. I would like to see the interviews that were held, and with who and what questions were asked and answered! I still think it was a coverup. The Register Front page shows a cop with a bloody hand, caption: the driver of the car was trying to get away and ran into the hand with the mirror!! LIE, the cop cut his hand while trying to smash the drivers window in with his gun. Window broke, cop drops gun inside, cop hollers GUN, two cops in front of the truck shoots, my son dead, Willie was shot in chest. Now if they are going to lie about the cut, what else did they lie about? We need a Citizens Review Board!!

Tom Davidson March 19, 2013 at 07:18 pm

Almost this same exact scenario played out yesterday in Santa Clara county. Their police had nothing to hide and were forthcoming with how the situation developed. Their story is that the deceased driver drove towards the cop who shot him.
Frankly, I see AmCan police pretending to be cowboys by their actions.

MICHAEL P WILSON "Independent Kid" March 19, 2013 at 07:29 pm

Did you file a Federal Civil rights lawsuit Of no Why?

Joy K March 19, 2013 at 07:49 pm

Mr. Stoddard,
I can understand your perspective and I'm sorry to hear of your loss. Like you, I have many personal feelings that affect me, my husband is an officer and these stories always have an impact on me as I'm sure they do you too. We recently buried one of his partners in a situation that went the other way. There are no easy answers to these situations and the bottom line is that they end bad more than anyone would like them to and many lives are affected when this happens.

Loui Loui March 19, 2013 at 07:52 pm

He chose to run from the police, he knew what the risks were.

Ernie Stoddard March 19, 2013 at 07:54 pm

Michael there was a lawsuit filed. I did not file as I was the Step-father, his mother did seek a lawyer and there are payments being made to his daughter.
There is still money beaning paid out over this indecent. I do not know if it is the City of Napa paying or the Insurance company. It matters who ever is paying. The bill is still being paid by the taxpayers.

Tom Davidson March 19, 2013 at 10:43 pm

OK, why would someone point a pair of pliers at anybody ?

Joy K March 19, 2013 at 11:10 pm

Ummm because they are under the influence of meth and marijuana as the report said, sometimes this can make people do weird things, even things they wouldn't normally do.

Ernie Stoddard March 20, 2013 at 02:50 am

Cops story, unverified.
Sorry dead man could not give his side of the story, as he is dead.

Ernie Stoddard March 20, 2013 at 02:55 am

Now lets see, he ran from the officers, without license plates on his car. That was reported as stolen. He was a homeless person. He was under the influence of meth and marijuana. All of this was found out AFTER he was killed!! The cops did not have any of this information until after he was dead..

vocal-de-local March 20, 2013 at 04:51 am

I probably shouldn't be telling this story to any of you, but when my brother was a teenager, a cop tried to pull him over for speeding. My brother was near our house and I could hear a siren. He cut across the field and quickly hid his motorcycle in our parent's garage. I could see the officer at the other end of the field looking puzzled and frustrated. I was shocked that my brother would do this.
Note that today my brother is (much to my dislike) a talking points conservative. He's also responsible, runs his own business and is involved with volunteering and giving back to the community. I do not advocate people outrunning cops, but if my brother had been killed that day just because he refused to stop, it would have been a loss on many levels, not only to his family but to others. He was a stupid teen but he didn't remain that way the rest of his life (well maybe the talking points stuff is an exception).. So before you all jump on that bandwagon of how people should be shot for making a dumb mistake, consider that we are probably all capable of being temporarily stupid or impuslive. Should we die for it? I suppose it depends on whether the person is acting violently or not, but even in that case, what if the person has mental health issues?

vocal-de-local March 20, 2013 at 05:40 am

Ernie, I'm listening to the story about your son. So do you think that the officer dropped the gun by accident into the vehicle after breaking a window? The officer yelled "gun" to forwarn his fellow officers that there was a 'possibility' that a gun could end out being possessed by your son? I mean, the officer just reacted instinctively. Nevertheless, it was a mistake, just a bad set of circumstances. They should not have lied to cover up a human mistake and it sounds as though they might have done so. I am sorry for your loss and I can tell that you still carry a lot of pain inside. I would feel the same way.

Ernie Stoddard March 20, 2013 at 05:54 am

Doesn't matter, cowboy cops want to go home at night, if that means shooting everyone that is breaking the law, and not doing exactly what you are told by a cop you could end up in the morgue.

vocal-de-local March 20, 2013 at 06:04 am

Earnie I think it does matter. Not every officer is a cowboy cop but I do think there are enough of them to warrant concern. I am interested in your story because it sounds as though the cop was negligent by putting the gun in a position where it could easily drop inside of a vehicle. The overreaction that occurred after that incident was a result of the officer shouting 'gun'. The officer should have been permanently removed from his position. I'll bet that did not happen.

Ernie Stoddard March 20, 2013 at 04:37 pm

Vocal, the finding was "officer involved shooting was justified" That means that no one was held accountable. I did hear that one of the officers quit because of the shooting. I have had first hand experience with cops that lie, and get there stories straight. I was awarded $50,000 dollars of tax payers money for this. Arbitrator ruled against the cops story, as I had more witness then they had cop lies. Oh did I forget to mention that one of the cops received a week off without pay for this ordeal. Oh did I also forget to mention that this same cop is the one that shoot and killed my step-son. I guess I should have no problem with what the cops say or do, just shut up and hope you don't have a shinny phone or object in your hands the next time you get pulled over.

vocal-de-local March 20, 2013 at 04:53 pm

It's a shame police aren't required to have video cameras on their weapons. In the case above involving Moreno, certainly there must be some video footage from the numerous police vehicles surrounding the stolen vehicle. These videos should become public property.
Problem with law enforcement hiring practices today is that they are probably hiring mostly ex military men who have served in combat. i think they become desensitized to the impact of using a weapon. I'm sure that this can happen in law enforcement training programs as well, but not to the same degree. We are in America and civilians should not be viewed as just numbers who pose a potential threat. I think that is the mindset of modern law enforcement. We are numbers, not much different than the numbers in a combat zone.

MICHAEL P WILSON "Independent Kid" March 20, 2013 at 04:58 pm

We can not have cameras What would the Welfare conspiracy nuts do with their time?

Ernie Stoddard March 20, 2013 at 05:17 pm

If we had cameras, we would end up with fewer shootings. And cops would not have to lie for each other.

Ernie Stoddard March 20, 2013 at 05:31 pm

Mike, I'm not a Welfare conspiracy nut. I just have a different point of view then all the "Cops said it, so it must be true", people like you. I just have to let people know that not all cops are bad. They have some bad apples that make it bad for the ones trying to do a good job. Because of, cops don't tell on cops mentality, it is almost impossible to get rid of the BAD COPS.

vocal-de-local March 20, 2013 at 05:38 pm

Yes Ernie. and this is where you should apply much of your energy, into some sort of legislation that requires law enforcement to video document events where weapons are used.
Nowadays, tiny cameras are available although I'm not sure how they would be charged up to last an entire day plus who would be responsible for charging them? I suppose they could be charged in the vehicle and attached to weapons after charging. This would require a backup charger. It would put another layer of responsibility on law enforcement but it might be to their advantage as well, when they had to justify use of their weapons. I do agree that it would make an officer think twice before pulling the trigger.

Trina Ann March 24, 2013 at 04:21 pm

Ernie, I am with you 100%. Ray should be here with us now. He is missed by many. I remember that day and his funeral. Im trying to recall the officers involved.
We need a Citizens Review Board

David April 11, 2013 at 06:38 pm

YA'LL NEED TO READ THE ARTICLE WORD FOR WORD, THA GUY REACHED INTO HIS PASSENGER SEAT AND BRANDISHED SOMETHING THAT COPS THOUGHT COULDVE BEEN A GUN, ITS CALLED SUICIDE BY COP, WHEN COPS HAVE THERE GUNS DRAWN ON U, AND TELL U TO DROP UR WEAPON OR WHATEVER, U DO IT, IF NOT, WELL, U GET TAKEN DOWN.